Am I insane?

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leela
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by leela » Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:41 pm

...And you need to be teaching them outside of a mainstream classroom.

In the right environment, when you can focus on what they need, it's intense, it's difficult, but it's great.
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by OnTheBall » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:03 pm

Firstly, I don't know why I didn't write it, but the $AUD160,000 is after tax. The amount is RMB1,000,000 which is around $AUD200,000, and after tax I think it is $AUD150-160K

BulletPark wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:53 am
Is it an annual contract? Is it the sort of thing where you could give it the initial period and see how it goes?

How is the quality of life in the NSW town vs what the money could get you in Shanghai?

Would it be easier for your wife to find work (or continue what she's doing now) from either location?

The Shanghai job sounds like the better option, but I like big cities.
In Shanghai I could live quite well and still save $100-$120K a year. The other aspects of life? I'd expect to work 6 days a week in SH, from 6am (I always get in early at work in China and prefer to do so. Morning person, I naturally always wake up at 3-4am), and probably stay in at least until 6-7pm Mon-Fri, and maybe mid-afternoon Saturdays. In Australia, from around 8am to 3pm Mon-Fri, some prep work during weekends. The Australian school seems to have low academic expectations of the kids as in their view they aim to give kids a bit of respite from their shitty home environment (where their bad behaviour stems from), as they work to help them transition back into their base school.

It would be easier for her to find work in SH, but I don't imagine it being too difficult to find work in Australia. There are retail jobs in this country town. She would be earning a lot more in Australia though (from around $AUD1200 in SH to probably around $AUD3200 a month after tax in Australia).

Lulu wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:17 am
Unless it costs 100,000 AUD annually to send the kids to international schools, sounds like Shanghai is the better option. I must have missed something?
Ranges anything from $US15K-$US22K per year per kid, from what I've seen in Guangdong, which is outrageous given that the quality of education is no better than what they would get back home for free. The decision isn't just about the money. Reasons for moving back to Australia are/were:

* Wanting to raise the kids in Australia, not China
* Pollution. Why would I take years away from my kids' lives by having them breath that toxic shit in China?
* My parents are getting older and they haven't had much chance to bond with their grandkids
* Beat is right. I am/was getting a bit sick of dealing with the Chinese and China. I'm under no illusions that if I were to take the job in SH (where I would have to work alongside a Chinese principal, with all of what that entails) it would be full of frustration and head banging against the wall moments (even more so than what every job has). I'm already seeing how disorganised they are.. The other week, they had all week to arrange an interview with me and waited until a Sunday midday to ask me if I could interview with them that afternoon.
misanthrope wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:31 am
You'd be insane to move to NSW for that kind of money.
The premier state. Cost of living at this town would be less than Sydney; no commuting (and no commuting time), so no $40-$60 weekly train or fuel expense, for starters. If I decided to settle in this town permanently, housing is quite a fair bit cheaper than Sydney, and it is a small "city". It's inland NSW, but it's still a nice place.

guruwil wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:33 am

Two incomes at a somewhat lower lever can be the same or better than a single higher one because of tax as well.
Income tax for foreigners in China is quite low relative to Australia.
k2w3 wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 3:52 am
Depends on the cost of living in Shanghai, although free housing ought to make it pretty low. I'd be tempted to go for the money option, at least 2-3 years. Early 40's is fine in the teaching game I'd have thought.
BulletPark wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 4:45 am


Yeah, after some thought that would be my answer too. I've recently stopped a job and couldn't be happier even though my income will take a hit for the foreseeable future.

Plus if the town is within a comfortable drive of Sydney you'll have a lot of big city amenities to hand.
Re: teaching in NSW, if I were to go to SH for 2-3 years, I would come back and start all over again, salary and teaching "level" wise. How the teaching gig works here is, most teachers start off as casuals, going to different schools in the area where they live, then a school might give them a teaching "block" (a term or half a year or a year or whatever), and then if they do well, "permanency." Don't think I would like to do the casual teaching thing after 2-3 years in SH, chasing casual days here and there, while also providing for my family, fuck that.

The town is about a 4.5-5 hour drive away from Sydney. The town has everything outer Sydney suburbs have, it is a bit of a hub for regional NSW.

mishmish wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:30 am
I understand both parties are open to moving elsewhere. What I don't understand is WHO doesn't recognize job experience from China? That's weird.
That's a big salary difference. I'd do it for a few years, but yes, maybe not to definitely a not-attractive destination like China is to you. The third option mentioned here may be best. i.e., keep look for a better paying job in Australia.
mishmish wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 6:33 am
I see. But I would think that the principle of a school would be easier to verify, no? Wouldn't he be employed by the government?
rezuar wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:19 am

Yup. With your experience, OTB, there must be better jobs where you are.
Teaching in NSW pays the same state-wide, whether you live in the middle of Sydney or out in Broken Hill. A teacher may actually get higher allowances for going to remote areas, this town doesn't qualify as remote though.

$AUD52K after tax (plus super) is for first year teachers, a four year teacher was making almost $AUD90k (before tax, plus super) and once I make Deputy Principal I'd be making $AUD100K plus (before tax, plus super), which is another reason for biting the bullet and just getting on with it here in NSW

The experience in China is not recognised for a number of reasons: 1. NSW considers overseas experiences on a case-by-case basis, but they would only consider teachers' experience in the UK and may be in countries such as Canada, NZ and maybe the US. They would also consider international schools with a "mainstream" curriculum (such as from the just mentioned countries). I would be the principal at a private (not state-owned) kindergarten, with its own (more than likely shit, tbh) curriculum. Kindergartens in China differ from NSW. In China they start from as young as 2 to 5. NSW kids can start preschool at 4 years of age (optional), then kindie at 5 and then primary.

Having said that, what got me the job offer at this NSW school is the fact that they did like my experience in China, as a lot of experienced teachers in NSW can't/don't want to handle these kids, and I went there in person to check the school out.

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Re: Am I insane?

Post by OnTheBall » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:14 pm

jessica_fletcher wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:21 pm
I haven’t read all the replies. Soz.


Working for 2 years in China, would mean you could set yourself up in Australia very nicely. Deposit for a house etc.

Also working with difficult children as your first job would be very very hard, I would re consider that but that’s just me.
Eh, I've been teaching for over a decade in China and mental health/behavioural issues aren't really recognised in China so I've had kids with issues in classes for years.
veronica_inheels wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:23 pm
but he is in china for decades. wasnt he already making 100K for years?

as a kindergarden director.
No, I was making just under that working for myself. Then I decided to get accredited, so I sold my biz (as I wouldn't have enough time to run a biz and do Uni full-time), and took a kindergarten principal job with my old boss. A position that paid a lot less, but wasn't very time consuming.
veronica_inheels wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:24 pm

its a shit job and every teacher knows it.
I went to see for myself yesterday, and it wasn't that bad. I grew up with kids who were just as bad/worse than these kids (south-west Sydney). Nothing they did yesterday or do in the future would shock me tbh.
leela wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:41 pm
...And you need to be teaching them outside of a mainstream classroom.

In the right environment, when you can focus on what they need, it's intense, it's difficult, but it's great.
The school only caters for kids from year 5 to 9, but they base their curriculum on the primary level. There is a limit of seven kids per class (although it is rare to have 7 kids in class on any day), plus they had 1-2 Student Support officers in every class. The way the Principal explained it to me, she wanted to individualise learning as much as possible, which I feel is doable given the number of kids in each class.

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leela
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by leela » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:19 pm

Wanting to bring your kids up in Australia rather than China trumps any of the downsides, I reckon.

And yep, that class size with support sounds right. Don't assume you've seen it all though. Until my school was reclassified, I spent my career with teenagers from awful backgrounds, with behaviour and mental health issues. And I could rarely transfer what worked with one kid, to another kid.
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by shunter » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:30 pm

Go for the money. Earn it while you can; you never know what’s round the corner. Dreams are for teenagers. How you deal with the job is a bigger opportunity for personal growth than something that appears great but will no doubt end up equally tedious - but far far less financially rewarding.
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by Bill Barilko » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:37 pm

The money won't do your kids any good they'll only be kids once and for too short a time they should grow up in a healthy environment with plenteous access to the outdoors.

Kids that I see here (both whites & Chinese) who've grown up in China are just geeks with little to no clue about anything.
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by EMG » Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:40 pm

Sounds like you're pretty set on Australia, and a lot of the reasons you outlined why make sense to me.

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Re: Am I insane?

Post by jessica_fletcher » Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:10 pm

Oi! Oi! Oi!

Decision made

Best of luck
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Re: Am I insane?

Post by Troll_Handle » Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:19 am

Money can be beguiling, but money doesn't equate to happiness. You clearly want to live in Australia again, so you have to bite the bullet sometime. It's just the first year, then your earnings go up or you find another job in Australia. Within a few years, you should be settled with all options open to you. If it doesn't work out how you hope, the opportunities in China will probably still be there, but you'll know you've tried to build a life in Australia so you won't be second guessing the decision and your parents will have had precious time with their grandchildren.

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Re: Am I insane?

Post by shunter » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:57 pm

I wouldn’t want my kids growing up in China.
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