Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Berning Trumpeters vs The Establishment

Moderator: Moderator

BulletPark
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 13581
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 7:40 pm

Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by BulletPark » Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:26 pm

Not to boast but it is what it is - my family is rich enough that barring the total collapse of the dollar we'll probably do fairly well for the next four years. We're not sticking out heads in the sand - come the second week of January we have a family meeting with our financial advisors to see how best we can weather the situation. But I will, on a personal level, be able to ride out the chaos in comfort.

This is not true of the trumpies, including Anno, Maxwell and sundry.

And as Trump's presidency strips you of your social security, medicare and other assorted benefits and rights I want you to know that I will be cracking open a bottle of very good champagne for every fuck he takes up your assholes. I'll even post pictures.

Champagne you can't afford now and certainly won't be able to afford come the end of 2017.

Stockpile that Kool Aid. You'll need it.

User avatar
section8
the Secret Sauce
Posts: 27925
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:46 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by section8 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:13 pm

I think maxwell and most of the trumpers are pretty old. Getting rid of social security and Medicare is all about fucking over people younger than they are. Any cuts won't apply to the oldsters, and they'll not live long enough to deal with any consequences anyway. They won't have to clean up any foreign policy messes either. It must be liberating to be an elderly nihilist.
This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.

User avatar
section8
the Secret Sauce
Posts: 27925
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:46 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by section8 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:19 pm

Although I'm not rich like you between my wife and I we are set to ride things out just fine. Many of the things that will harm the majority of voters will either not apply to us (or we will actually benefit from) or we will be able to get by fine without it (ss for example).

You can use this op to thank trump supporters for voting for your interests instead of their own.
This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.

User avatar
Chip_Oatley
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 27307
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 5:39 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Chip_Oatley » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:23 pm

section8 wrote:I think maxwell and most of the trumpers are pretty old. Getting rid of social security and Medicare is all about fucking over people younger than they are. Any cuts won't apply to the oldsters, and they'll not live long enough to deal with any consequences anyway. They won't have to clean up any foreign policy messes either. It must be liberating to be an elderly nihilist.


I agree they're pretty old. Jim has already benefited plenty from socialized medicine and government payouts, for example. Any real pain will hit people who are now under 60.

Maxwell using the word "queers" is a dead giveaway that he's quite old.

Why won't you and your wife be hurt, and why don't you think your employer might be gutted?

User avatar
section8
the Secret Sauce
Posts: 27925
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:46 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by section8 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:48 pm

We are knowledge workers with pedigrees living in a trump state. As frightening as having a single party control the house, senate, and presidency, our system is set up to dampen the flailing actions of unwashed radicals like we have now.
This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.

User avatar
Ignominy
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 7298
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:34 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Ignominy » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:11 pm

I am frustrated that ShitBoomers like Max won't starve to death.
Je suis le champignon vénéneux qui fait vomir l'intrépide.

User avatar
Chi_Rup
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 24092
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:08 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Chi_Rup » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:29 pm

Maxwell is old? I can't imagine the journey that ends with that as the final act. That must suck. Bill Clinton should have done something.

As long as stocks go up, my pension and wages will be fine. We have producers working on what audiences want 10-20 years ahead, they're pretty good. Money is easily pleased, people will travel the world for safe conservative entertainment.

The key thing is, in this environment, to keep working and keep your income above the cost of living. Fuck knows how Max, Anno and Jim are going to do, they never talk about life beyond the volkskampf.

Yet you're aware that at any moment it could end because that's how apocalyptic personality cults always end. I don't have an exit, can't afford one.

BulletPark
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 13581
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 7:40 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by BulletPark » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:41 pm

section8 wrote:Although I'm not rich like you between my wife and I we are set to ride things out just fine. Many of the things that will harm the majority of voters will either not apply to us (or we will actually benefit from) or we will be able to get by fine without it (ss for example).

You can use this op to thank trump supporters for voting for your interests instead of their own.


Not boasting, I hope everyone understands, and hope everyone here gets by okay for the duration.

Except for the trumpies.

They can die. In poverty.

User avatar
Ignominy
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 7298
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:34 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Ignominy » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:44 pm

I'll be just fine as a regulatory parasite in DC.
Je suis le champignon vénéneux qui fait vomir l'intrépide.

User avatar
Jim-2012
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 9122
Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:32 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Jim-2012 » Sat Dec 31, 2016 11:54 pm

section8 wrote:Although I'm not rich like you between my wife and I we are set to ride things out just fine. Many of the things that will harm the majority of voters will either not apply to us (or we will actually benefit from) or we will be able to get by fine without it (ss for example).

You can use this op to thank trump supporters for voting for your interests instead of their own.

Is anyone predicting a calamitous downturn in the US economy?
The stock market has already improved even before Trump has taken office.
I expect 2017 will be as good as 2016 has been for me.
“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”
“Always drink upstream from the herd.”

BulletPark
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 13581
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 7:40 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by BulletPark » Sun Jan 01, 2017 12:25 am

Jim-2012 wrote:
section8 wrote:Although I'm not rich like you between my wife and I we are set to ride things out just fine. Many of the things that will harm the majority of voters will either not apply to us (or we will actually benefit from) or we will be able to get by fine without it (ss for example).

You can use this op to thank trump supporters for voting for your interests instead of their own.

Is anyone predicting a calamitous downturn in the US economy?
The stock market has already improved even before Trump has taken office.
I expect 2017 will be as good as 2016 has been for me.


Jim, I don't know. My investments are warning me of an unprecedented time of unsurety. The world of real estate (from which my family derives a great deal of its wealth) has just been told to batten down the hatches. Trump is a stupid, greedy, selfish man who had a long grudge list and no sense of national security. We could all be in for a bumpy ride.

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23284
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:50 am

My field is certainly in Trump's crosshairs. That said, I'm sure I'll do just fine the next four years. The DC swamp will be flooding.

User avatar
avalon_
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 24368
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:26 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by avalon_ » Sun Jan 01, 2017 3:05 am

Anyone with children that attend public schools should be worried. The appointed secretary wants to destroy public education. We're all fucked with the environment.

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 64371
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Godjira » Sun Jan 01, 2017 3:35 am

The dollar has strengthened considerably against the yen, which is good for exports.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23284
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:09 am

I don't think there's much Trump or any president can do to "destroy public education", as it's mostly a state and local thing. They may whip out some sort of half-assed voucher program, but I don't think there's much they could do to force blue states to participate.

User avatar
avalon_
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 24368
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:26 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by avalon_ » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:28 am

That's my hope. However, many schools rely on Title 1 funds and low income students need Pell Grants to attend college. I couldn't have attended without it.

Do you think those are on the chopping block?

User avatar
section8
the Secret Sauce
Posts: 27925
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:46 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by section8 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:40 am

Your first graders need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

Jim-2012 wrote:
section8 wrote:Although I'm not rich like you between my wife and I we are set to ride things out just fine. Many of the things that will harm the majority of voters will either not apply to us (or we will actually benefit from) or we will be able to get by fine without it (ss for example).

You can use this op to thank trump supporters for voting for your interests instead of their own.

Is anyone predicting a calamitous downturn in the US economy?
The stock market has already improved even before Trump has taken office.
I expect 2017 will be as good as 2016 has been for me.


I didn't predict a calamitous downturn in the economy. The stock market is going to contract, but not because of Trump. Deficit spending is going to go through the roof but I think that can be OK if conditions allow for it, plus my taxes will likely be going down. I'm also looking longer term for detrimental impacts. SS and medicare are prime targets over the next four years, and people aged 40-55 will probably the ones who have to take that the hardest, but none of that will have any impact on you. Of course 2017 will be as good for you as 2016.
This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23284
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:41 am

No. I really don't think Congress will go after either, especially considering getting rid lf Title I would be a major net loss for poorer states, which not incidentally are red states. I guess hypothetically they could require districts that get a lot of Title I dollars to offer voucher and charter options, but there would need to be some dollars attached to make the latter happen. And I don't see that being passed, especially considering education reform is pretty low on the list of priorities.

User avatar
section8
the Secret Sauce
Posts: 27925
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:46 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by section8 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:51 am

It will be interesting to see if the republicans blow off their entire political ideology now that they have all three bodies. The last time this happened they massively jacked up spending and create entire new agencies.
This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.

Lost Soul
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 52733
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 2:02 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Lost Soul » Sun Jan 01, 2017 7:17 am

section8 wrote:It will be interesting to see if the republicans blow off their entire political ideology now that they have all three bodies. The last time this happened they massively jacked up spending and create entire new agencies.

Yeah, it's my biggest fear.

Deep down, both parties are big-government bozos.

McBane and Grahamnesty are already talking bollocks, thinking it was they who won.
IMPRISON BUSH!

INDICT HILLARY!

"Lost Soul is largely correct"- VinnyD

User avatar
ExPat From Hell
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 4161
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 4:37 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by ExPat From Hell » Sun Jan 01, 2017 8:55 am

Yep. I just paid my annual medical insurance premium. US based insurer. $5,000 for a year. But I really don't use it. Just in case I need to be flown out of bumfuck they send a copter. I pay cash for all of my medical needs. I could probably get reimbursed for some of these expenses. But really, I can not be arsed to fill out the forms. I can not imagine having a life in which I had to do that.
Not gay as in happy. Queer as in Fuck You.

User avatar
nycfellow
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 4063
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 12:59 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by nycfellow » Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:40 pm

People here keep saying that those over 60 won't be affected by cuts to SS and Medicare, but that's not true for the plans that Ryan and others in Congress are already pushing. The Medicare voucherization plan will involve large cuts in benefits - the Congressional Republicans are assuming that the process will be so opaque (and they'll make it as opaque as they can) that retirees will blame their insurance companies rather than the government expenditure cuts. They are probably right. For SS, they won't do nominal benefit cuts for current recipients. But they are going to change the indexation formula, which means that current recipients will get less than they would have. Again, the hope is that no one will realize this is a significant cut, and again, they're probably right.

User avatar
avalon_
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 24368
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:26 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by avalon_ » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:00 pm

What I don't understand is why they want to cut SS and medicare. What good will it do? What's their reasoning? I assume they think it will save money, but what are they planning to spend the money saved on? Do they benefit personally from this? I'm just not understanding the motivation.

User avatar
section8
the Secret Sauce
Posts: 27925
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:46 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by section8 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:14 pm

avalon_ wrote:What I don't understand is why they want to cut SS and medicare. What good will it do? What's their reasoning? I assume they think it will save money, but what are they planning to spend the money saved on? Do they benefit personally from this? I'm just not understanding the motivation.


Hopefully one of the republicans here have the answers for you.

It is reassuring to read that under their plans current beneficiaries get at least partially fucked. Usually they buy off the 60+ vote by promising to screw over everybody but them. SS gets me a bit pissy because it's not some welfare program - I've paid into it for 25 years and will likely pay in for another 25 years. Fuck that smarmy little fuckhole in Wisconsin if he thinks he gets to play games with that system because he read too much Ayn Rand.
This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.

aero
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 2326
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 10:32 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by aero » Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:32 pm

I am also going to be fine. My job is pretty secure for the next year or two and the Seattle real estate market will do OK thanks to Microsoft, Google, Amazon and others so I don't see my home value taking a big plunge. Plus I can escape to Canada whenever I want.

I think changes to Medicare and SS should be across the board and include current recipients. But even then I think a lot of people would miss the implications and vote against their interests. Paul Ryan would definitely like to replace Medicare with premium support vouchers, so seniors would pay a lot more or have to limit their medical care, which would certainly affect Jim and Maxwell.

User avatar
Chip_Oatley
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 27307
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 5:39 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Chip_Oatley » Sun Jan 01, 2017 7:01 pm

avalon_ wrote:What I don't understand is why they want to cut SS and medicare. What good will it do? What's their reasoning? I assume they think it will save money, but what are they planning to spend the money saved on? Do they benefit personally from this? I'm just not understanding the motivation.


I'd be interested in being involved in a collective effort to protect SS/Medicare.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:19 pm

Cuts to SS are generally about the solvency of the program, people generally want the payroll tax to be able to pay for all benefits.

Medicare (and Medicaid) cuts are about how much money those programs consume and the fact they consume a greater % of tax receipt as time goes on.

Whether you think there should be "cuts" or not, it shouldn't be controversial to say both program's finances look dark in the long run.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 51954
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by eric84 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:23 pm

Medicare is still way cheaper than private health care which why health care reform trying to universalize medicare has been tried so many times. I thought that was obvious.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:27 pm

I'm not sure what that has to do with anything, but ok.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 51954
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by eric84 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:40 pm

Your suggestion that medicare's finances look dark. Bullshit, compared to rest of the health care system and Paul ryan's plan is definitely a cut, no need to put it in quotes.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:44 pm

It is certainly not bullshit that medicares finances look dark. I also didn't say anything about solutions or Ryan's plan.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 51954
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by eric84 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:51 pm

Then compare to non-medicare health care in the us and tell me what's worse.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:58 pm

Why? You're asking me to defend an argument I haven't made. I was simply responding to the question of why some politicians want to cut Medicare and/ or social security.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 51954
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by eric84 » Sun Jan 01, 2017 10:15 pm

Well, if you say the finances are dark, you're comparing it to something. Obviously, any program catering to seniors when you have an aging pop is going to up in the costs.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:57 pm

It's dark given how spending outpaces economic growth every year and shows no sign of stopping. Obviously the problem exists in the private sector as well.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 51954
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by eric84 » Mon Jan 02, 2017 12:15 am

It's much worse than the private sector because medicare is better able to control costs. Which is why a universal health care system makes sense.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Mon Jan 02, 2017 12:27 am

Yes. Again completely irrelevant to my posts.

User avatar
shunter
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 17014
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 1:56 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by shunter » Mon Jan 02, 2017 12:43 am

muthafunky wrote:It's dark given how spending outpaces economic growth every year and shows no sign of stopping. Obviously the problem exists in the private sector as well.


Is it wrong or illogical that a society, as it gets richer, should spend more on health? I mean we have all the cars and computers and Hi-fi we need - and are living longer - therefore health becomes more important - it's the one thing that we can and need to spend more and more on until we're all living to 90 and beyond.
1988: "We have a climate in Britain in which business wants to succeed and can succeed." Margaret Thatcher, speech to launch the European Single Market

2018: "Fuck business." Boris Johnson

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Mon Jan 02, 2017 12:56 am

The trajectory is unsustainable in the US

BulletPark
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 13581
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 7:40 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by BulletPark » Mon Jan 02, 2017 1:03 am

muthafunky wrote:The trajectory is unsustainable in the US


How so?

And, more to the point, what can we expect to do to make it sustainable?

User avatar
shunter
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 17014
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 1:56 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by shunter » Mon Jan 02, 2017 1:04 am

People getting older, during of illnesses that cost millions to treat, it's going to be more and more expensive. But what's the proportion of GDP sounded on health? Is it that much?
1988: "We have a climate in Britain in which business wants to succeed and can succeed." Margaret Thatcher, speech to launch the European Single Market

2018: "Fuck business." Boris Johnson

User avatar
Chip_Oatley
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 27307
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 5:39 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Chip_Oatley » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:40 am

Unless you've gone through the process of evaluating different Medicare plans, you can't really know what it entails. I quizzed my parents after my elderly colleague (recently deceased) admitted that she hadn't signed up for Medicare (!). It's not as simple as "here, this is free." You have to choose Medicare Part B and decide what pharmaceutical plan etc. you need. They're paying something like $175 each out of pocket each month for anything beyond the very basic.

User avatar
rider5
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 17742
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:45 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by rider5 » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:03 am

Anyone remember the Simpson Bowles commission? The two washed up politicians with no agenda who went through the budget the last time Congress was freaking out about financial responsibility?

No one does. It's too bad, a lot of the bugaboos they put to rest including SS would have easily been solved then and probably could be today.

User avatar
avalon_
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 24368
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:26 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by avalon_ » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:35 am

But if they cut medicare, what will people do? Won't they just die? Or go to the ER and not pay their bills?

One of my parents two years ago was a lobbyist for medicare.

User avatar
nycfellow
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 4063
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 12:59 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by nycfellow » Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:30 am

Well, there are lots of well off older people. They will just pay more. Then there are the in-between people. They will blow through their retirement savings that much faster, and then be dependent on children, if they have any. Some will simply not get the medical care they need, and they will die. Some will get inferior, more expensive care at the ER and the rest of us will bear the burden. This is already what has been happening for the big uninsured slice of the population. It is why middle class people in the US have health outcomes that compare to poor people in the UK. And poor people in the US look like those in middle-income countries.

As to why Republicans want to cut SS, Medicare and Medicaid - that's easy. Look at the budget. Those 3 programs, plus defense and interest payments are the vast majority of expenditures. It you want to cut taxes, and they do, and you don't want to cut defense, and they don't, then that's the only place where the money is. You can eliminate Energy, Education, SBA, EPA, HUD and you get nowhere, because the money involved is so little.

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 64371
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by Godjira » Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:44 am

You have to give up everything you own basically.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:09 am

BulletPark wrote:How so?


Health care spending has gone from like 5% of GDP to 20%, costs have risen faster than inflation, the economy, or tax receipts for the past few decades. Financial models of the US government's budget shows medicare and medicaid consuming everything at some point if nothing changes.

And, more to the point, what can we expect to do to make it sustainable?


There are quite a lot of things that could be tried, none of them easy from a political standpoint. Personally, I'd prefer a single payer system, but recent elections tell me I'm probably in the minority.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:12 am

shunter wrote:People getting older, during of illnesses that cost millions to treat, it's going to be more and more expensive. But what's the proportion of GDP sounded on health? Is it that much?


Government spending on healthcare is around $1 trillion. US GDP is around $18 trillion.

User avatar
muthafunky
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 22061
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:50 am

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by muthafunky » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:14 am

avalon_ wrote:But if they cut medicare, what will people do? Won't they just die? Or go to the ER and not pay their bills?

One of my parents two years ago was a lobbyist for medicare.


I don't think I've seen medicare reform proposals where people would just not have coverage and die because of it. Most of the cutting would assume there is more spending by citizens to help cover the bills, the theory being that the well off do not necessarily need medicare to pick up the full tab anyway and programs like medicaid are there to pay for people who can't afford health care that medicare doesn't cover.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 51954
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Face it - I'll do fine through the Trump Presidency

Post by eric84 » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:25 am

Once you eliminate the universality of a program and it becomes just for the poor, it becomes easier to cut. Terrible idea.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

Post Reply