The Saudi cunts.

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DCComic
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by DCComic » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:30 pm

You're over-complicating a very simple issue.
The Saudis are using Western arms to kill Yemeni kids.
The Western arms manufacturers and governments who supply them are complicit.
Stop selling the fuckers the weapons.
Easy.

"Oooh, but somebody else will sell them the weapons."
They probably will.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by simon_in_exile » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:34 pm

It’s a good discussion - would these hypothetical sanctions be put in place to make Canadians feel better about themselves, or to actually enforce a change in Saudi (/Qatar/Iran/[insert country with displeasing law])?
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by simon_in_exile » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:35 pm

DCComic - on the weapons, I agree. But then I’m not personally a fan of weapons sales anyway.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by polardude1 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:36 pm

I'm guessing the Chinese would step right in and fill the void
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by eric84 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:41 pm

simon_in_exile wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:34 pm
It’s a good discussion - would these hypothetical sanctions be put in place to make Canadians feel better about themselves, or to actually enforce a change in Saudi (/Qatar/Iran/[insert country with displeasing law])?
It's ultimately up to the Saudis to judge how big a price they want to pay. Ultimately, having the commonwealth impose sanctions on South Africa ended up working. I've heard just the act of banning them from international sporting competition did a lot to force change there.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by simon_in_exile » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:45 pm

There are articles written about the effect of sanctions on countries, and South Africa is one of the only places where they have had the (stated) intended result. I currently see the effects where I live, and they’re not going to cause a decrease in support for a leader (quite the opposite in fact).

Back to the OP story: here are my thoughts on this from two years ago, when nobody had upset the Canadians and it wasn’t a hot topic:
http://politicalstew.com/viewtopic.php? ... ilit=Yemen
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by eric84 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:56 pm

simon_in_exile wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:45 pm
There are articles written about the effect of sanctions on countries, and South Africa is one of the only places where they have had the (stated) intended result. I currently see the effects where I live, and they’re not going to cause a decrease in support for a leader (quite the opposite in fact).

Back to the OP story: here are my thoughts on this from two years ago, when nobody had upset the Canadians and it wasn’t a hot topic:
http://politicalstew.com/viewtopic.php? ... ilit=Yemen
Strange, you seemed more concerned with the West backing the Saudis back then but the suggestion to maybe not sell them arms doesn't go over with you too well.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by simon_in_exile » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:05 pm

You’re getting confused again between me debating a topic from different angles, and me having a personal point of view.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by eric84 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:08 pm

simon_in_exile wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:05 pm
You’re getting confused again between me debating a topic from different angles, and me having a personal point of view.
I guess I am. I'm usually more consistent. If I think my country is contributing to a war like the one in Yemen, never mind what Saudi does to its citizens, I don't want my government to sell arms to them.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by DCComic » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:11 pm

eric84 wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:08 pm
simon_in_exile wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:05 pm
You’re getting confused again between me debating a topic from different angles, and me having a personal point of view.
I guess I am. I'm usually more consistent. If I think my country is contributing to a war like the one in Yemen, never mind what Saudi does to its citizens, I don't want my government to sell arms to them.
Do you think anybody in this thread disagrees with that?
I don't.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by eric84 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:13 pm

Ah, ok, I see Simon agrees. There may be a class of commercial products that I also may ban if I thought were being used to violate people's rights.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by simon_in_exile » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:15 pm

I already clarified my own point of view once here - but the world’s problems and disagreements don’t get solved without exploring the topic from the points of view of others (and that’s also much more interesting).
simon_in_exile wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 6:42 pm
My personal view? Hell yeah, ditch the arms contracts. Sweden did.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by 2wilzgood » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:57 pm

An amazing wiki blurb on different points of view

In a speech on the Syria crisis on September 10, 2013, Obama said: "however, when, with modest effort and risk, we can stop children from being gassed to death, and thereby make our kids safer over the long run, I believe we should act... That is what makes America different. That is what makes us exceptional." In a direct response the next day, Russian President Vladimir Putin published an op-ed in The New York Times, articulating that "It is extremely dangerous to encourage people to see themselves as exceptional, whatever the motivation... We are all different, but when we ask for the Lord's blessings, we must not forget that God created us equal." Putin's views were soon endorsed by future president Donald Trump who declared the op-ed "a masterpiece" to British television personality Piers Morgan
September 2013

Obama - Let's act to stop children being gassed.

Putin - God wills the gassing of children.

Trump - Amen to that, Vlad.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by simon_in_exile » Mon Aug 13, 2018 9:18 pm

That was a year after the Red Line comments debacle (and while the US was still selling weapons to Saudi to bomb Yemen). Not one of his finest moments, sadly.
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Re: The Saudi cunts.

Post by DCComic » Mon Aug 13, 2018 9:27 pm

2wilzgood wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:57 pm
Putin - God wills the gassing of children.
What rot.

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/opin ... wanted=all
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