Is China Losing the Trade War?

Main Course
User avatar
LonelyTeaPot
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 2830
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2013 3:09 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by LonelyTeaPot » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:39 pm

Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:31 pm
Godjira wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:13 am
Thanks for that Smokey!
Your welcome; it is my pleasure to point out the hypocrisy of not just you but all the partisan puppets.

When Trump attacks NAFTA that is bad but when Hillary said in the 2008 election campaign "You know, I have been a critic of NAFTA from the very beginning...” there isn't a peep out of the partisan puppets.

Obama puts on tariffs that is a-ok but Trump does the same thing and he is a baddie.

The hypocrisy of the partisan puppets never ends.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
With Hillary it's all talk but no action. In all likelihood she was only fishing for varmint votes but wouldn't have changed a thing about NAFTA once in power. Trump follows through with his election promises. I can't say which is better.
Last edited by LonelyTeaPot on Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Flobster!
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 31456
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 12:12 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Flobster! » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:40 pm

Perhaps, but that would still be less than 1 in 10 people, and it would take more than one US election cycle to happen.
The pies and sausage rolls are good in Australia - Iolar

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:47 pm

Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:31 pm
Godjira wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:13 am
Thanks for that Smokey!
Your welcome; it is my pleasure to point out the hypocrisy of not just you but all the partisan puppets.

When Trump attacks NAFTA that is bad but when Hillary said in the 2008 election campaign "You know, I have been a critic of NAFTA from the very beginning...” there isn't a peep out of the partisan puppets.

Obama puts on tariffs that is a-ok but Trump does the same thing and he is a baddie.

The hypocrisy of the partisan puppets never ends.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
I was very critical of those things when Hilary and Obama did them. I always thought NAFTA was a good thing, and I didn't like Hilary pandering to rightarded votes.

Still, you should worry more about yourself than what other people think. You appear to be a huge jackass.

LOL
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:55 pm

Godjira wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:47 pm
I always thought NAFTA was a good thing.
It still can be if everyone agrees to a 5 year sunset clause.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:01 pm

That's loser talk
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:02 pm

Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:34 am
Godjira wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 11:47 am
That’s the best you can do?
Yes a direct and specific example of "President Barack Obama’s Chinese tire tariff fiasco of 2011.

Hey Godjira the partisan puppet, how come when Obama puts a tariff in place it is a-ok with the liberal elite but when Trump does it he is a baddie?

Warmest Regards, Smoker
Once again, you fail to understand equivalencies. US administrations do get into trade disputes and impose tariffs for products. What Trumpiedoodle is doing goes well, well beyond that in starting trade war on 3 fronts at the same time on a wide range of products and threatening to impose even more tariffs. This is not what past Presidents have done, not even close.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:13 pm

eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:02 pm
This is not what past Presidents have done, not even close.
Past presidents have allowed US the manufacturing base to shrink. President Trump is reversing that trend.

I do admire Canada's resolve to stand up to the US. It is a very courageous thing to do.

Good luck and may the best economy win.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:15 pm

twodogs wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:13 pm
eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:02 pm
This is not what past Presidents have done, not even close.
Past presidents have allowed US the manufacturing base to shrink. President Trump is reversing that trend.

I do admire Canada's resolve to stand up to the US. It is a very courageous thing to do.

Good luck and may the best economy win.
Trumpiedoodle is not reversing that trend. You've not provided any evidence that he has.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:04 pm

eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:02 pm
Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:34 am
Yes a direct and specific example of "President Barack Obama’s Chinese tire tariff fiasco of 2011. Hey Godjira the partisan puppet, how come when Obama puts a tariff in place it is a-ok with the liberal elite but when Trump does it he is a baddie?
Once again, you fail to understand equivalencies.
And right on time here we see the classic excuse from the pretend American partisan puppet: "When my person puts a tariff on or talks against a free trade agreement they are just trying to be fair & what they did really isn't that bad but when Trump the clown boy does it he is evil".

The hypocrisy of the partisan puppets never ends.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:11 pm

LonelyTeaPot wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:39 pm
Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:31 pm
Godjira wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:13 am
Thanks for that Smokey!
Your welcome; it is my pleasure to point out the hypocrisy of not just you but all the partisan puppets.

When Trump attacks NAFTA that is bad but when Hillary said in the 2008 election campaign "You know, I have been a critic of NAFTA from the very beginning...” there isn't a peep out of the partisan puppets.

Obama puts on tariffs that is a-ok but Trump does the same thing and he is a baddie.

The hypocrisy of the partisan puppets never ends.
With Hillary it's all talk but no action. In all likelihood she was only fishing for varmint votes but wouldn't have changed a thing about NAFTA once in power.
Maybe but we really won't ever know since she didn't win however if I had to bet I agree with you that she was probably just telling a lie for votes.
LonelyTeaPot wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:39 pm
Trump follows through with his election promises. I can't say which is better.
I just hope to Allah that Trump is just making noise and pulls back on the protectionism before any global trade war.

Anyone that thinks a global trade war is "winnable" for anyone other than a few domestic special interest groups really needs to bush up on the history of the 1930s.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:17 pm

Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:04 pm
eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:02 pm
Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:34 am
Yes a direct and specific example of "President Barack Obama’s Chinese tire tariff fiasco of 2011. Hey Godjira the partisan puppet, how come when Obama puts a tariff in place it is a-ok with the liberal elite but when Trump does it he is a baddie?
Once again, you fail to understand equivalencies.
And right on time here we see the classic excuse from the pretend American partisan puppet: "When my person puts a tariff on or talks against a free trade agreement they are just trying to be fair & what they did really isn't that bad but when Trump the clown boy does it he is evil".

The hypocrisy of the partisan puppets never ends.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
I didn't say any of that, smoker. I just said what Obama did on tires isn't equal to Trump starting a 3 front trade war. Why don't you put aside your talking points and address directly what I said. Do you agree with it? If not, why not?
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:42 pm

eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:15 pm
Trumpiedoodle is not reversing that trend. You've not provided any evidence that he has.
Insulet Corporation manufactures insulin delivery systems. In 2017 the company announced it would be moving the production of its flagship product -- the Omnipod, a tubeless, waterproof insulin pump -- from China to a new facility in Acton, Massachusetts. Insulet cited the area's skilled workforce and rising labor costs in China as reasons for the move. If Insulet meets earnings expectations for the next several years, the new facility could employ as many as 1,500 workers by 2021.

Element Electronics opened a new flat screen television factory in Detroit. The decision was based on a need to consolidate the company's supply chain, and made Element one of the only companies to manufacture televisions in the U.S. Element also reshored production from China to Winnsboro, South Carolina with an initial $7.5 million investment in a new plant that is projected to lead to the creation of 500 jobs. The TV manufacturer cited Walmart's pledge to buy $250 billion of U.S.-made products from 2013 to 2023 as a primary reason to relocate operations to the United States.

Gentex closed its two plants in China and Mexico in an effort to centralize production in Zeeland, Michigan. While labor was less expensive overseas, the move to consolidate all stages of production in one location is likely to reduce transportation costs and the risk of manufacturing error. Amount to a total of 1,600 jobs for U.S. workers.

In a January 2018 meeting with President Donald Trump, Amgen CEO Robert Bradway announced that the firm was planning to add 1,600 manufacturing jobs in the U.S.

Merck, along with pharmaceutical manufacturers Pfizer and Corning, have committed to making a joint investment of at least $4 billion in pharmaceutical glass manufacturing in the U.S. The partnership will focus on the manufacturing of advanced pharmaceutical glass packing, a technology used in the storage of injectable drugs, as well as vials and cartridges, and is projected to lead to the direct. hiring of 4,000 U.S employees across the three companies.

Merck also recently reshored approximately 300 jobs as part of its efforts to consolidate its overseas operations in the U.S. The company relocated the headquarters of its animal health division from Boxmeer, the Netherlands to its campus in Summit, New Jersey.

SolarCity announced a deal with the State of New York that commits the company to invest approximately $5 billion over the next 10 years in return for a $750 million construction subsidy that is projected to create at least 1,900 jobs.

Polaris Industries announced plans to build a $142 million off-road vehicle plant in Huntsville, Alabama that will create an estimated 2,000 manufacturing jobs in the area.

Caterpillar has announced reshoring projects that will target facilities in Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, and Texas, and will add or retain an estimated 2,100 U.S. manufacturing jobs. In 2012, Caterpillar opened a new facility in Victoria, Texas with an initial investment of $200 million in an effort to shift production of its hydraulic excavators from Akashi, Japan to the U.S. In August 2015, Caterpillar announced plans to expand employment at its Victoria facility, moving its vocational truck manufacturing operations from Mexico to the Texas location.

Whirlpool has announced several efforts to consolidate its overseas operations within the U.S. that will add up to an estimated 2,165 reshored jobs for domestic manufacturing workers. Most recently, in January 2018 Whirlpool announced it would be adding 200 full-time employees to its facility in Clyde, Ohio. The news came shortly after the Trump Administration announced safeguard tariffs on large imported residential washing machines, a move projected to reduce import competition from Whirlpool rivals Samsung Electronics and LG Electronics.

General Electric has announced domestic capital investments that are projected to add approximately 2,700 jobs to the U.S. manufacturing workforce.

Dow Chemical announced plans to invest $6 billion in its manufacturing plants in Texas and Louisiana in an effort to capitalize on lower domestic natural gas prices. According to a Dow executive, the increase in U.S. fracking activity has created significant investment prospects for chemical producers in the United States that will pay off in the next several years. The Gulf Coast reshoring effort is largely focused on the production of ethylene, propylene, and chemical derivatives used in packaging. The company's reshoring efforts announced over the past several years are projected to retain or add approximately 2,900 manufacturing jobs to the U.S.

Intel announced plans to hire 4,000 U.S. workers and build a $5 billion microprocessor plant in Chandler, Arizona. Known as Fab 42, the plant will use the 7-nanometer production process and is projected to be the most advanced, high-volume microprocessor plant in the world. While the facility was completed in 2013, its opening was stalled for several years. In February 2017, however, Intel announced plans to open the facility with a total investment of $7 billion and the direct hiring of 3,000 high-tech, high-wage workers. The tech giant projects the plant will be completed in the next two to three years, and will indirectly lead to the creation of roughly 10,000 jobs throughout Arizona.

In January 2017, Ford announced plans to cancel the $1.6 billion expansion of its Mexico production facility, instead opting to expand operations at its Flat Rock, Michigan facility with a $700 million investment projected to create 700 jobs. Similar reshoring efforts by the U.S. auto giant have been announced over the past eight years, targeting facilities in Indiana, Illinois, Ohio, New York, and other parts of Michigan and totaling an estimated 4,200 new jobs for the domestic workforce.

Boeing has rapidly expanded its U.S. workforce at various manufacturing plants throughout the East Coast. Boeing began operations at a new plant in Charleston, South Carolina in 2011 that manufactures 787 Dreamliner planes. Boeing also recently moved parts of its production of the new 777X plane from overseas to its St. Louis facility. The first 777X is projected to be completed by December 2019. According to the Reshoring Initiative, since 2010 Boeing has announced plans to reshore approximately 8,000 jobs, the most of any U.S. company other than General Motors and Apple.

General Motors has made several announcements regarding various reshoring efforts that will boost employment at its plants in Michigan, New York, Tennessee, and Texas. The largest announcement came January 2017, when GM made public its plans to add or retain 7,000 jobs in the U.S. over the next few years. One of the major reshoring projects will be the shifting of approximately 600 jobs from an axle production plant in Mexico to a new facility in Arlington, Texas.

In January 2018, Apple announced plans to invest over $30 billion in capital expenditures in the U.S. over the next five years. As part of the investment, Apple is increasing its commitment to its Advanced Manufacturing Fund -- used to invest in U.S. manufacturing companies and boost the domestic manufacturing sector -- from $1 billion to $5 billion. The move is projected to create over 20,000 new jobs at Apple's existing campuses and at a new office location which has yet to be announced.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:43 pm

Even lots of anecdotes doesn't equal data. Show me what the manufacturing sector is doing relative to the rest of the US economy to convince me that he's 'reversing a trend'.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:48 pm

Not relative to the rest of the economy just an improvement in manufacturing from past administrations. Think of it as the opposite of what is about to happen to Canada.

Good luck and may the best economy win.
Last edited by twodogs on Fri Jun 29, 2018 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Fri Jun 29, 2018 5:07 pm

twodogs wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:48 pm
Not relative to the rest of the economy just an improvement in manufacturing from past administrations. Thing of it as the opposite of what is about to happen to Canada.

Good luck and may the best economy win.
Right, you don't have any such evidence to back up your claim that he's reversing a trend.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

coffeeguy
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 9312
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 3:26 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by coffeeguy » Fri Jun 29, 2018 5:40 pm

twodogs wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:48 pm
Not relative to the rest of the economy just an improvement in manufacturing from past administrations. Think of it as the opposite of what is about to happen to Canada.

Good luck and may the best economy win.
Until recently when the US started fucking us over, the Canadian economy has been outgrowing all the G7 economies, including the US. Your whole posting is ridiculous, as if in a trillion dollar economy employing 100’s of millions of people, a dozen investment announcements are somehow indicative of a trend. Any country on earth could show the same. The truth of the matter is the US exnomy has been slowing since trump took office and almost all of the growth has been debt fueled by the massive deficits you are now running up.

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Fri Jun 29, 2018 5:47 pm

Remember. All 2dogz cares about are his precious, precious tax cuts. As a fellow on a fixed income, he needs every cent.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:12 pm

So more manufacturing jobs is bad for the economy?
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:11 pm

eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:17 pm
I didn't say any of that, smoker. I just said what Obama did on tires isn't equal to Trump starting a 3 front trade war.
Exactly! You as the pretend American partisan puppet are pretending when your person does protectionism it is ok & justified and not equivalent but just leveling the paying field yada yada yada but when the other guy that beat your person in an election does the same thing and implements tariffs or whatever it is because he is evil.

Total pretend American partisan puppet hypocrite crap!

Trump's protectionism is wrong just like it was wrong when Hillary & Obama tried to sell protectionism FOR VOTES!

Have the guts to be honest for once in your life and condem a supid policy even if it is your person that is promoting it.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:20 pm

It was especially bad under Reagan with his rampant protectionism, but you won’t see Smoker mentioning that.

He’s desperate to equate Trump with Obama - to the point of sickness.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:54 pm

Apparently Canada now thinks Trump was right and plans to follow suit.

It's not just the US that is locked in an escalating trade war with China: according to Bloomberg, Canada is also preparing steel quotas and tariffs targeting Beijing meant to prevent dumping of steel imports from global producers seeking to avoid U.S. tariffs.

Implicitly confirming that Trump was right to launch protectionist measures against China, and that others would have done it if they had the stomach to disturb the global trade order, the Canadian measures are said to be "a combination of quotas and tariffs aimed at certain countries including China" and follow similar “safeguard” measures being considered by the European Union aimed at warding off steel that might otherwise have been sent to the U.S. It comes alongside Canadian counter-tariffs on U.S. steel, aluminum and other products set to kick in on July 1."
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:57 pm

Nasdaq is up 8.79 ytd

Image

Shanghai is down 13.90 ytd

Image

Juche!!!
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Flobster!
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 31456
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 12:12 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Flobster! » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:11 am

You're assuming that Chinese billionaires have the same political leverage that US billionaires do. They don't.
The pies and sausage rolls are good in Australia - Iolar

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:37 am

Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:11 pm
eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:17 pm
I didn't say any of that, smoker. I just said what Obama did on tires isn't equal to Trump starting a 3 front trade war.
Exactly! You as the pretend American partisan puppet are pretending when your person does protectionism it is ok & justified and not equivalent but just leveling the paying field yada yada yada but when the other guy that beat your person in an election does the same thing and implements tariffs or whatever it is because he is evil.

Total pretend American partisan puppet hypocrite crap!

Trump's protectionism is wrong just like it was wrong when Hillary & Obama tried to sell protectionism FOR VOTES!

Have the guts to be honest for once in your life and condem a supid policy even if it is your person that is promoting it.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
Right you can’t engage meaningfully and honestly compare obama and trump on trade because you may have to conclude that what trump is doing is infinitely worse and you can’t have that
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:25 am

Image
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
guruwil
vegemite flavored maple syrup
Posts: 25980
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 4:44 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by guruwil » Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:38 am

Lost Soul wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:34 pm
Flobster! wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:30 pm
Did you read what he said? They'll take losses but they can sustain them much longer than the US can. It's a dictatorship.
Doubtful. They are afraid of a Chinese uprising of 100,000,000 unemployed people.
With the largest standing army in the world, a huge secret police network, massive surveillance capacity and the demonstrated will and capacity to arrest, disappear and execute dissidents, there will certainly be a democratic removal of a Trump long before there is a successful uprising in China.
An it harm none, do what ye will

We are all Atheists about most gods, some of us just go one god further.
judik wrote:Guruwil was right!!!
jono_in_adelaide wrote:I think Guru is right on this one
“shunter” wrote: I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: Guru is bang on the money here.

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:22 am

eric84 wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:37 am
Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:11 pm
eric84 wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:17 pm
I didn't say any of that, smoker. I just said what Obama did on tires isn't equal to Trump starting a 3 front trade war.
Exactly! You as the pretend American partisan puppet are pretending when your person does protectionism it is ok & justified and not equivalent but just leveling the paying field yada yada yada but when the other guy that beat your person in an election does the same thing and implements tariffs or whatever it is because he is evil.

Total pretend American partisan puppet hypocrite crap!

Trump's protectionism is wrong just like it was wrong when Hillary & Obama tried to sell protectionism FOR VOTES!

Have the guts to be honest for once in your life and condem a supid policy even if it is your person that is promoting it.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
Right you can’t engage meaningfully and honestly compare obama and trump on trade because you may have to conclude that what trump is doing is infinitely worse and you can’t have that
And it is always the same from the partisan puppet's classic infliction the "Halo Effect".

Partisan puppet logic! When my person does it then it is ok but when your person does it; it is evil.

You trying to defend Obama's tariffs and Hillary's attack on NAFTA sound like twodogs trying simultaneously to be FOR FREE TRADE but excuse Trump's protectionism because it is not really protectionism but trying for a level playing field yada yada yada.

Your person's Obama & Hillary were slimy like twodog's person Trump and it is probably because they are all politicians thus have the same motive to appease domestic special interest groups for votes & support yada yada yada.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:42 am

Who is defending Obama’s tariff?

I do defend Obama’s record on TPP and TTIP.

Trump destroyed what could have been a historic moment for free trade.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 12:46 pm

Smoker wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:22 am
eric84 wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:37 am
Smoker wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:11 pm

Exactly! You as the pretend American partisan puppet are pretending when your person does protectionism it is ok & justified and not equivalent but just leveling the paying field yada yada yada but when the other guy that beat your person in an election does the same thing and implements tariffs or whatever it is because he is evil.

Total pretend American partisan puppet hypocrite crap!

Trump's protectionism is wrong just like it was wrong when Hillary & Obama tried to sell protectionism FOR VOTES!

Have the guts to be honest for once in your life and condem a supid policy even if it is your person that is promoting it.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
Right you can’t engage meaningfully and honestly compare obama and trump on trade because you may have to conclude that what trump is doing is infinitely worse and you can’t have that
And it is always the same from the partisan puppet's classic infliction the "Halo Effect".

Partisan puppet logic! When my person does it then it is ok but when your person does it; it is evil.

You trying to defend Obama's tariffs and Hillary's attack on NAFTA sound like twodogs trying simultaneously to be FOR FREE TRADE but excuse Trump's protectionism because it is not really protectionism but trying for a level playing field yada yada yada.

Your person's Obama & Hillary were slimy like twodog's person Trump and it is probably because they are all politicians thus have the same motive to appease domestic special interest groups for votes & support yada yada yada.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
Again, I have to do this every time: I have not defended obama’s tariff. I have said this now 3 times and yet everytime I repeat it, you reply I defend it. I’ll ask again to see you’ll avoid this question: is what trump is doing at all comparable with what obama did on creating tariffs?
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:56 pm

"is what trump is doing at all comparable with what obama did on creating tariffs?"

Similar but on a much grander scale.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:00 pm

I think the key is that Trump is a right wing fool who doesn’t know WTF he’s doing.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:41 pm

eric84 wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 12:46 pm
Again, I have to do this every time: I have not defended obama’s tariff. I have said this now 3 times and yet everytime I repeat it, you reply I defend it. I’ll ask again to see you’ll avoid this question: is what trump is doing at all comparable with what obama did on creating tariffs?
Trump is scum just like Obama or Hillary when it comes to protectionism so admit they are all suck rather than pretend your person is cool but the others are scum.

They all suck Erid84 including your person etc so just be honest for once in your pardison pupput life and admit it!

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:16 pm

Smoker wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:41 pm
eric84 wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 12:46 pm
Again, I have to do this every time: I have not defended obama’s tariff. I have said this now 3 times and yet everytime I repeat it, you reply I defend it. I’ll ask again to see you’ll avoid this question: is what trump is doing at all comparable with what obama did on creating tariffs?
Trump is scum just like Obama or Hillary when it comes to protectionism so admit they are all suck rather than pretend your person is cool but the others are scum.

They all suck Erid84 including your person etc so just be honest for once in your pardison pupput life and admit it!

Warmest Regards, Smoker
Again, they may suck but they don’t equally suck, a point you can bring yourself to admitting
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:59 pm

Obama was a protectionist, President Trump is a better protectionist. Maybe not on the same scale as Canada but getting there.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:08 am

Obama wasn’t a protectionist. He tried to bring the US into the TPP and TIPP.

Trump is an idiot who doesn’t know what he is or the difference between his ass and a hole in the ground.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:27 am

OBAMA TARIFF ACTIONS:

1. Obama put tariffs on solar panels.

2. Obama slapped tariffs on tires.

3. Obama put tariffs on imported steel.

President Obama stated on Jan. 24, 2012: “I will not stand by when our competitors don’t play by the rules. We’ve brought trade cases against China at nearly twice the rate as the last administration – and it’s made a difference. Over a thousand Americans are working today because we stopped a surge in Chinese tires. But we need to do more. It’s not right when another country lets our movies, music, and software be pirated. It’s not fair when foreign manufacturers have a leg up on ours only because they’re heavily subsidized.”
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Godjira
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 67189
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:52 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Godjira » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:50 am

Those were a bad idea- especially the solar panels. The Chinese whipped our butts on solar panels.

But three tariffs don’t make Obama a protectionist. In fact, he tried to get the US into the TPP and TTIP.

I’m not sure if Trump is a protectionist per se, now. I think he’s just a complete fool. He’s like a retarded King Lear.
That's the kind of bold flavor they enjoy in Albuquerque!

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:59 am

Obama pissed away billions backing losing companies like Solyndra in California.

Since Trump lowered taxes and reduced regulations Sun Power, First Solar and Jinko are all building new plants.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23746
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:01 am

twodogs wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:59 am
Obama pissed away billions backing losing companies like Solyndra in California.

Since Trump lowered taxes and reduced regulations Sun Power, First Solar and Jinko are all building new plants.
Yet, growth is lower and the deficit is rising quickly.

Point goes to Obama.

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23746
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:04 am

And, it didn't "lose billions":

Lost in the hubbub following President Obama's climate agreement with China was a smaller bit of surprising environmental news Wednesday: the Department of Energy's loan program is expected to make money for taxpayers.

Most people are familiar with the program because of Solyndra, a solar-panel manufacturer that went bankrupt in 2011 after borrowing $528 million from the federal government. Solyndra was one of a few bad bets the feds made -- Fisker Automotive, which built electric cars, went under last year.

You can't avoid defaults when you lend money, though, and on balance, the loans are being repaid. A report released in the next several days will give the department's first estimates of how the program is performing financially: the loans and guarantees will earn at least $5 billion over 20 years or so, according to a Bloomberg article citing a single anonymous source.

Two points Obama.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:05 am

How come all this good news takes 20 years or so to occur?
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23746
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:07 am

twodogs wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:05 am
How come all this good news takes 20 years or so to occur?
Have you ever heard of the concept of a loan term?

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23746
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:08 am

Given the fact that the president doesn't directly control the Fed took your whole lifespan up until today to reach you.

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:53 am

eric84 wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:16 pm
Again, they may suck but they don’t equally suck, a point you can bring yourself to admitting
Total crap, you just can't admit that your person like Trump is just another politician with the motive of appeasing some domestic special interest group for support & votes and trying to split hairs over "when my guy does it then it isn't bad like when the other guy does it then it's evil" is just being a partisan puppet.

It also destroys your credibility when it is not the act that is bad but who is doing it.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
Smoker
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8602
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:15 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Smoker » Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:16 am

twodogs wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:27 am
OBAMA TARIFF ACTIONS:

1. Obama put tariffs on solar panels.

2. Obama slapped tariffs on tires.

3. Obama put tariffs on imported steel.

President Obama stated on Jan. 24, 2012: “I will not stand by when our competitors don’t play by the rules. We’ve brought trade cases against China at nearly twice the rate as the last administration – and it’s made a difference. Over a thousand Americans are working today because we stopped a surge in Chinese tires. But we need to do more. It’s not right when another country lets our movies, music, and software be pirated. It’s not fair when foreign manufacturers have a leg up on ours only because they’re heavily subsidized.”
The economy is connected and Obama's tire tariffs save a thousand "not efficient or effective" tire jobs but then the knockdown effect loses more jobs than that in other parts of the economy forced to pay more for a product of less quality.

Obama's teriffs on imported steel cost thousands and thousands of American jobs.

Protectionism only helps whatever special interest group Obama or Trump or whoever is trying to appease at that point in time.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
ben_hanscombe wrote:You're such a fucking cunt, Smoker. A really revolting piece of shit.

VinnyD wrote:She was over nine, she was a very mature nine-year-old

Godjira wrote:You're a filthy, vile idiot.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:56 pm

Before starting the tariffs President Trump reduced taxes and regulations making manufacturing more efficient. Now companies foreign and domestic are expanding manufacturing facilities in the US.

This means any job losses due to tariffs should be offset by more domestic productions. There will be some lag time but judging by the pace of industrial construction it won't be long and the citizens of the US will benefit for decades. That is the beauty of having the world's largest economy. Free trade would be nice but the US can produce anything it needs or wants domestically.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
eric84
Moderator
Posts: 55267
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by eric84 » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:12 pm

Smoker wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:53 am
eric84 wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:16 pm
Again, they may suck but they don’t equally suck, a point you can bring yourself to admitting
Total crap, you just can't admit that your person like Trump is just another politician with the motive of appeasing some domestic special interest group for support & votes and trying to split hairs over "when my guy does it then it isn't bad like when the other guy does it then it's evil" is just being a partisan puppet.

It also destroys your credibility when it is not the act that is bad but who is doing it.

Warmest Regards, Smoker
I’d be curious to know what special interest group wanted to open a 3 front trade war but yes you can find people or groups in favour of some of the tariffs but overwhelmingly most interest groups think what trumpiedoodle is doing is madness.

None of that is relevant to the point that what trumpiedoodle is doing on tariffs is far worse than obama. I’m not sure why you can’t bring yourself to agree with that rather obvious point.
Love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair.

User avatar
twodogs
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8247
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by twodogs » Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:13 pm

eric84 wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:12 pm
None of that is relevant to the point that what trumpiedoodle is doing on tariffs is far worse than obama. I’m not sure why you can’t bring yourself to agree with that rather obvious point.
Not far worse, far grander.

Obama did it piecemeal President Trump knows the US has the highest hand and is playing it to the hilt. The US can produce far more than it consumes. now that taxes and regulations have been reduces we are witnessing companies from all over the globe rushing to build plants in the US so they can gain access to the largest market in world.

It is sad that our closest neighbors do not want to be part of this so.....

Good luck and may the best economy win.
More irrational spitefulness coming from twodogs...

User avatar
matt_melb
Stew Ingredient
Posts: 8609
Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2012 10:45 pm

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by matt_melb » Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:26 pm

Flobster! wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:37 am
Reducing regulations almost always means

1. Harming the environment
2. Making workplaces less safe
3. Making workplaces less fair
4. Making food less safe
5. Making medicines less safe
6. Increasing disparities in health
7. Increasing disparities in education

and so on.

While it might well be a good idea to review regulations now and then, to sort out overlaps and redundancies, a government running on a blanket 'reduce regulations' platform is ALWAYS trying to make its citizens' lives worse.
Hmm. To take a random example, Flobster, do you think things were better back when businesses had to get permission from the Reserve Bank to buy or sell foreign currency above a specified limit?

User avatar
Citizen Baba
Mayor McCheese
Posts: 23746
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 5:44 am

Re: Is China Losing the Trade War?

Post by Citizen Baba » Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:00 pm

Trade barriers make domestic industries more efficient. Who knew?

Didn't Latin America try that "import substitution" for much of the 20th century? How did that go?

Post Reply